# Selling price for ua.ca?



## Nafti (Jan 11, 2021)

I noticed just a few years ago (maybe 2?), ua.ca was listed for sale. I now see that it’s owned by Under Armour. Anyone here sell this one or know what Under Armour paid for it?


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## RedRider (Jan 11, 2021)

OMG, they own the .com too  *YAHOO*


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## theinvestor__ (Jan 11, 2021)

That’s the tricky part about domains. You can always compare other domain sales but it doesn’t mean that your buyer will match that. 

It all comes down to how badly the company needs the domain and whether you have the balls to say no to large offers. I recently had an offer of 30K for a domain and I completely ignored it. He hasn’t come back...this happens more than you think. It’s easy to say no but you better be prepared to not get the sale. 

In this instance, I feel like the value will increase over time and there are a lot of different potential end users. So, in this case other than under armour how many other possible end users are there? Not saying the domain sold cheap...but can’t be too greedy with domains or you sell none.


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## MapleDots__ (Jan 11, 2021)

theinvestor said:
			
		

> I recently had an offer of 30K for a domain



I turned down an offer for 100k USD on one of my domains recently.
I cannot say that is the first time I have turned down larger offers. Some domains only come around once, if you sell them to cheap there is no doing it again. You end up looking at the end user and it turns out to be an LLC company like Under Armour and you kick yourself forever for selling it that cheap.

I am currently dealing with a couple of LLC companies and they will have to use either *ca.domain.com* or *domain.com/ca* or they will have to come up with a significantly higher offer.


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## theinvestor__ (Jan 11, 2021)

We all can’t be blind to the fact that sometimes offers come and they may never come again. I just look at my previous sales...some have changed names or have went bankrupt. If I rejected those offers; I wasn’t going to get them again because they were mediocre domains. 

You won’t know you’ve made a mistake until it’s too late but I can assure you companies will walk on domains. You see that every day with the domains that are being registered.


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## MapleDots__ (Jan 11, 2021)

theinvestor said:
			
		

> If I rejected those offers; I wasn’t going to get them again because they were mediocre domains.



I will agree with that statement 100%

However if it was an offer on one of your better domains you can always find another buyer.

Really good domains are in limited supply, you can cave and give them up or stand your ground.
Somewhere, someone that made a fortune on a domain had to continuously say no. Had he said yes it would have been like any other mediocre sale.


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## Esdiel (Jan 11, 2021)

Nafti said:
			
		

> I noticed just a few years ago (maybe 2?), ua.ca was listed for sale. I now see that it’s owned by Under Armour. Anyone here sell this one or know what Under Armour paid for it?



I don't think you saw it for sale 2 years ago since Under Amour has had it forwarding to their main website since at least Dec 18th, 2014 (as per archive.org). And it looks like it sold via a listing on Excellent Domains (aka excellent .ca).

According to archive.org, the domain was still forwarding to Excellent until at least Jan 7th, 2014, and Excellent only took the listing down Jan 18th, 2015. This, coupled with the fact it's been forwarding to Under Armour since at least Dec 18th, 2014, leads me to believe it was likely sold sometime in early Dec 2014... I'm not sure how Excellent works (or worked in the past), but it seems pretty clear it was sold by someone other than the owner of Excellent Domains (otherwise they should have taken down the listing down earlier). Excellent also never reported the sale price (I already checked).

In summary, it likely sold sometime in Nov or early Dec 2014 at an undisclosed price due to an NDA.







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## Nafti (Jan 11, 2021)

Esdiel said:
			
		

> I don't think you saw it for sale 2 years ago since Under Amour has had it forwarding to their main website since at least December 18th, 2014 (as per archive.org). And it looks like it sold via a listing on Excellent Domains (aka excellent .ca).



Great catch. For some reason it seemed like it was only a couple of years ago. There must have been a NDA signed because I believe Ilze from Excellent.ca normally discloses her prices. As she knows it’s great for the market.


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## rlm__ (Jan 12, 2021)

Esdiel said:
			
		

> In summary, it likely sold sometime in Nov or early Dec 2014 at an undisclosed price due to an NDA.



Ilze just emailed me today, I'll ask her about it.


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## domains (Jan 12, 2021)

So let's talk some numbers, UA is a decent example, not perfect because UA is their acronym and stock symbol, but their name is Under Armour, so you'd think they'd be interested in UA.ca and underarmour.ca

This is a well known brand, $8 billion US market cap today, selling in Canada and worldwide.

If you held the generic ua.ca what would you ask for it today if you knew it was the company approaching you?

Or, let's even say it's a well known consumer company with a market cap of $500 million to 1 billion, selling in the US and Canada and maybe also worldwide, and they have their .com but want your generic .ca that matches.  What kind of price range are we in here?

From those who have dealt in this situation, do you also consider how far they'd be willing to go (e.g.: They could easily pay $1 million without denting their net income but mentally the people on their site could never get their head around it).


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## theinvestor__ (Jan 12, 2021)

It’s a million dollar name if you know it’s under armour. The question is who is on the other end. How bad do they need this domain and do they understand the value behind it? Are they branding already as UA? There’s so many questions. 

Now, what would I ask? It’s really hard to say. It’s a six figure name for sure. I typically don’t just give out my prices. The first step is to have them make an offer. Then you would take it from there. 

If the first offer is 5K I would handle it differently then if the first offer is 100K. Nonetheless to answer the question I wouldn’t take less than six figures. The rest is based on my gut feeling and how the negotiations are going.


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## MapleDots__ (Jan 12, 2021)

theinvestor said:
			
		

> If the first offer is 5K I would handle it differently then if the first offer is 100K. Nonetheless to answer the question I wouldn’t take less than six figures. The rest is based on my gut feeling and how the negotiations are going.




Here is my observation negotiating on deals...

The first 5-10k is the most difficult to get, in my last negotiation that took almost two weeks. From 10 to 50k happens relatively fast because you know the person offering 10k really wants the domain.

So for me it jumped from 10 to 100 in a very short period of time.
I was then told I was a fool for not selling at 100k and that I would never in my life get an offer like that again.

Hmm, that is a few times I have been called a fool for not selling, strange that the offers keep coming though.

I am feeling confident that as an industry we will have 1 or more million dollar .ca sales this year.


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## domains (Jan 12, 2021)

In my example, say it's a company like UA, you know it's them, you have the generic ua.ca, so what do you ask?  100k?  1 million?

Say you know it's a $5 Billion company that sells in US and Canada to consumers in stores everywhere, you have the generic .ca of their company name, they already own the .com.

What should the price range be on this domain?  What would you ask, what would you reasonably hope to get?


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## MapleDots__ (Jan 12, 2021)

domains said:
			
		

> In my example, say it's a company like UA, you know it's them, you have the generic ua.ca, so what do you ask?  100k?  1 million?
> 
> Say you know it's a $5 Billion company that sells in US and Canada to consumers in stores everywhere, you have the generic .ca of their company name, they already own the .com.
> 
> What should the price range be on this domain?  What would you ask, what would you reasonably hope to get?



Personally for an LLC company I would pull a Rick Schwartz and ask 2.5 million.

I know a lot of you are going to laugh and say it cannot happen but I say it can.
A domain acquisition is an expense and therefore fully tax deductible for the company.

You have to look how much business they do in Canada per year and does it justify them buying the domain.

Again, if I were a betting man I would say we will eventually see the odd sale like this.


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## theinvestor__ (Jan 12, 2021)

It doesn’t matter how big the company is. It all depends on how much value they put on the domain. You can’t get 1M if you don’t ask and if the company is not prepared to pay that. 

It’s pretty simple...so at some point you will lose sales or we would all be millionaires.


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## domains (Jan 12, 2021)

To answer my own question on UA, I'd hope I'd at least go for 250k US range, probably ask more and know they would negotiate down.

For these global companies I'm not sure how necessary the .ca is to them, for example UA could just use their .com in Canada and likely be fine.  And maybe they still do.

Almost the bigger issue to them is if another company gets the .ca and uses it.  When a company identifies themselves with a name or brand, they seem to like to own it everywhere and everyhow.


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## theinvestor__ (Jan 12, 2021)

I think what we want and what we may get are two different things. 

I have plenty of .CA’s where the .COM is owned by billion dollar companies and they don’t care. I’ve had interaction with a few and they just won’t pay. Time will tell...but as time goes on it’s apparent the way we think of .CA’s is not the same as how others are viewing it. Business goes on even with their .COM domain.


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## domains (Jan 12, 2021)

I am more talking about if you own the exact .ca company name, or one of their main products, and it's a well known consumer company in Canada that most people know.  A company that you regularly see advertise on tv, or at sporting events, etc.

For example, if you owned generics like aw.ca or tide.ca I would think the associated companies would have great interest.


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## theinvestor__ (Jan 12, 2021)

domains said:
			
		

> I am more talking about if you own the exact .ca company name, or one of their main products, and it's a well known consumer company in Canada that most people know.  A company that you regularly see advertise on tv, or at sporting events, etc.
> 
> For example, if you owned generics like aw.ca or tide.ca I would think the associated companies would have great interest.



There are so many examples but what about FB.ca. Facebook owns .com but obviously doesn’t care about .CA.


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## domains (Jan 12, 2021)

But they do care about facebook.ca  - that's the kind of domain I'm referring to here.  Lots of big companies own dozens or hundreds of .com domains, and I wouldn't expect them to get every matching .ca.  

But if it's their exact company name or main product(s), then I believe most would be interested.


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## theinvestor__ (Jan 12, 2021)

Well it probably cost them $0 to get. If it’s a TM it costs them nothing. Look at some of the CIRA disputes there are many occasions where companies attempted to get the .CA simply on the means they believe they own TM rights. Once they lose, they still don’t purchase it.


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## rlm__ (Jan 12, 2021)

theinvestor said:
			
		

> I have plenty of .CA’s where the .COM is owned by billion dollar companies and they don’t care. I’ve had interaction with a few and they just won’t pay. Time will tell...but as time goes on it’s apparent the way we think of .CA’s is not the same as how others are viewing it. Business goes on even with their .COM domain.



This is the issue.  These companies _have_ to have the .com.  Anything else is a _really_nice but not must have.  We have major Canadian companies that still just redirect the .ca to the .com/ca/ (see aircanada).  In fact there are many companies doing the domain.com/ca/ thing, that is their next best option to paying what they feel is extortion.  What we need is consistently high pricing so that it doesn't feel like extortion.  Then again, if everyone agreed to price their LL.ca's at $1M each, that would be a cartel and price fixing - which is obviously illegal.

Maybe the best scenario is more like Adam's recent situation.  Rather than a global business that has the .com, maybe you want a massive Canadian business that has a hard-on for a flagship domain with a realization that they'll never get the .com, so then the .ca starts to look pretty good as the next best option.

Personally, I also think it would be best for everyone if we all put a high BIN price on our domains - but then have a link to make an offer.  If every other option a customer has is also priced high, then you can argue your price isn't out of line, but that still leaves you the option to negotiate down in order to close a deal.  If they shop around and see a bunch of other LL's priced at $25K and suddenly yours is $2.5M, well yes, of course it's going to look like extortion and most people will refuse, not based on whether or not the company can afford it, or if its worth it, but on principle alone.


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## domains (Jan 12, 2021)

And at least in the tech area, there are companies that can't get the .com but will opt instead for a .io, or even a .co.  So a Canadian tech company might see .io and .co as the #2 choice to .com


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## Nafti (Jan 12, 2021)

rlm said:
			
		

> Personally, I also think it would be best for everyone if we all put a high BIN price on our domains - but then have a link to make an offer.  If every other option a cust



^^^^^ Yes, that’s what I have done with a couple of mine and will start doing the same with most of mine.  Sometimes I wonder if just having a high BIN is a good idea. Sure, it works if the buyer wants the domain bad enough but why not have both? Would there be a downfall for having both?


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## rlm__ (Jan 13, 2021)

Nafti said:
			
		

> Would there be a downfall for having both?



Not if you're willing to negotiate.


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## RedRider (Jan 13, 2021)

theinvestor said:
			
		

> I think what we want and what we may get are two different things.
> 
> I have plenty of .CA’s where the .COM is owned by billion dollar companies and they don’t care. I’ve had interaction with a few and they just won’t pay. Time will tell...but as time goes on it’s apparent the way we think of .CA’s is not the same as how others are viewing it. Business goes on even with their .COM domain.



For some companies million dollar domains are bargains
https://dnd.com/domain-name-acquisi...ity-in-a-world-of-asymmetrical-opportunities/


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